Comando Supremo: M1937 Tunic - Comando Supremo

Jump to content

Icon Message from the Comando Supremo staff

Follow us now on Twitter!


  • 2 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

M1937 Tunic

#1 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 30 May 2011 - 03:36 PM

Hi

I'm gathering information on the M1937 tunic.

Does anyone have details/pictures of the black fabric collar of the M37? From the pictures I've seen it looks like it is made of plain black cotton cloth (?) but I'm unsure if it is sewn over a grigioverde collar or actually makes up the collar itself.
Also does anyone have dimensions of the 'peaked' cuff found on the M37?

Rich
0

#2 User is offline   Frederico Aquini 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 235
  • Joined: 02-October 08
  • LocationOregon, US

Posted 07 June 2011 - 06:34 AM

I think at least part of the collar was grigioverde. The link below is the best image I could find.

http://www.saintjohn...a/Page6/11r.jpg

The collar on this tunic rises up just a little and if you look closely, you can see g/v underneath. Though I thought the black part was wool... :unsure:

Sorry I don't have more detailed info. for you. I'm rather fond of the M37 myself!

Frederico
0

#3 User is offline   sgtbrown 

  • Maresciallo Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 150
  • Joined: 28-July 10
  • LocationNE Ohio

Posted 07 June 2011 - 01:36 PM

Here are a couple photos of the collar area on my M37 tunic. The collar is made of a velvet material of unknown (to me) composition. As can be seen here, it is attached to the underlying GV wool collar by the red binding in this particular instance.

Cannot help you with the cuff measurements as the "peaked" cuff was only on the enlisted jackets. The officers jackets, like this one, had straight cuffs.

Tom

Posted Image

Posted Image
********************************
"The German is like the June bride. He knows he is going to get it; he just doesn't know how big it will be." General Richard "Windy" Gale to the 6th Paras just prior to D-Day
0

#4 User is offline   Ardito 

  • Soldato
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 11
  • Joined: 19-August 07
  • LocationITALY

Posted 13 June 2011 - 06:33 AM

I see that there is much confusion in understanding the models of jackets used by italian Em.
The jacket that you photographed is a common M33 officer, not Em's M37, the Em's tunic had neck jackets in black wool,
and not in velvet profiled.
After the reform of general Baistrocchi in 1933, the first jacket designed for Em is the model 33.
Were initially Modified the old M26 jackets, opening the collar, and changing the front opening.

Posted Image

The real M33 jacket is this:
Posted Image
Posted Image

This is the M37 tunic for Em, have a new belt ad rear pouch closed with automatic buttons.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
This is the tunic used during the WW2 the M40:
Posted Image
Posted Image

After the sanctions, Italy found itself without raw materials, and was forced to make many sintetic materials. At the end of 1942 produces a new type of wool
and officially adopted the wool is double-sided
called "Type 343"


Posted Image
Posted Image

This new type of wool after the armistice with the Allies of september 43
is captured by the Germans in large quantities and was used to produce new uniforms for
the Wehrmacht, and SS.


Posted Image
0

#5 User is offline   sgtbrown 

  • Maresciallo Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 150
  • Joined: 28-July 10
  • LocationNE Ohio

Posted 13 June 2011 - 01:15 PM

View PostArdito, on 13 June 2011 - 06:33 AM, said:

(Much snipping)
The jacket that you photographed is a common M33 officer, not Em's M37,


Whoops! :o

Goes to show what happens when I shoot my mouth off. Sorry!

Tom
********************************
"The German is like the June bride. He knows he is going to get it; he just doesn't know how big it will be." General Richard "Windy" Gale to the 6th Paras just prior to D-Day
0

#6 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 13 June 2011 - 01:48 PM

Thanks chaps; some very good information there.

Frederico, from looking at your's and Ardito's pictures the rear area of the collar does indeed show grigioverde.
There is similar material and stitching on my Chen M40 repro - all this indicates to me that the black cloth is layed over the grigioverde collar.

If this is right I'm guessing it will be stitched as per Tom's picture of the officer's tunic.

The annoying thing is I saw a detached black cloth RE collar on ebay a while ago but passed on it ("what would I ever do with that?" :blink:).

I'm now thinkng that the material used for the EM tunic is wool - most likely baize.

If there were a image of a M37 with up-turned collar the construction might be confirmed; does anyone own a M37 or have such a picture?

Cheers
Rich
0

#7 User is offline   Frederico Aquini 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 235
  • Joined: 02-October 08
  • LocationOregon, US

Posted 16 June 2011 - 08:07 PM

Ardito,

Thank you for sharing those images! :)

I was not aware they had converted the M26's into M33's -very interesting! I've never seen an M33 like the one you posted, with the large rear "hunter's" pockets. I had thought they didn't have them, like the one here: http://www.saintjohn...Page6/index.htm
Is it possible the one you pictured had the pockets added on later?

I have also never heard of this "Type 343 wool", although I have seen pictures of German uniforms made out of it. Perhaps you could write a little more about it?

Frederico
0

#8 User is offline   Frederico Aquini 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 235
  • Joined: 02-October 08
  • LocationOregon, US

Posted 16 June 2011 - 08:48 PM

Rich,

I am also thinking that the black is laid over the g/v and it does seem to be a more of a "badge cloth" or baize material. Other nations before and during that era using tunics with a different colour collar constructed them in a similar manner (the German M15, M19, M21 and M36 tunics for example).

Are you thinking of possibly trying to convert a repro. M40 into an M37? ;) Once my M40 from Remo arrives, my Chen made tunic will be "obsolete". It's one of his earlier productions lacking the rear pockets and I was thinking of turning it into an MVSN tunic by making straight pocket flaps, however, an M37 would be cooler. Although I'd still have to add back pockets and pointed false cuffs.

Frederico
0

#9 User is offline   Ardito 

  • Soldato
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 11
  • Joined: 19-August 07
  • LocationITALY

Posted 17 June 2011 - 09:01 PM

The jackets on saintjohn website, are all mine.
The tunic M33 photographed was modified by the soldier by removing the back pocket to make it more fitting.
I sold it after I found this regulatory M33 jacket with back pocket. M33 jackets are really rare.
With regard to wool type 343, I can only add that it is low in wool, for the most part is made ​​of synthetic fibers,
did not have good thermal characteristics, it was not very strong, and for this reason
factories of uniforms they had to add internal bracing.
He was hated by the soldiers, there are some era photographs that testify to the use.
Ciao, Luca.
Posted Image
0

#10 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 19 June 2011 - 10:58 PM

That's the image I was after - thanks a lot Luca.

Yes Frederico, that's what I'm aiming at. I've got an expendable first generation Hong Kong Keith M40 which I want to down-grade to a M37 - the sleeves are overlong so should be modifiable with regard to the 'peaked' cuff; the button holes in the rear pockets can be carefully sewn up and I'll do without a cloth belt for the moment. It was the collar I was most interested in getting right, but now thanks to all the help, I can set to work.

Thanks again
Rich
0

#11 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 01 July 2011 - 02:49 PM

Hi Chaps

Here are a few pictures of my M37 project as of today...













Cheers
Rich
0

#12 User is offline   Moncello 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 220
  • Joined: 31-July 09
  • LocationUK

Posted 11 July 2011 - 07:55 AM

View PostRiccardo, on 01 July 2011 - 02:49 PM, said:

Hi Chaps

Here are a few pictures of my M37 project as of today...

Attachment 1Image000cropped.JPG

Attachment 1Image001cropped.JPG

Attachment 1Image003cropped.JPG

Attachment 1Image004cropped.JPG

Attachment 1Image056cropped.JPG

Attachment 1Image057cropped.JPG

Cheers
Rich



Camerati,
I saw Camerata Riccardo's tailoring yesterday.... nice Schmuter.... :P
0

#13 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 14 July 2011 - 08:11 PM

Not quite swords into ploughshares, but I hope an honourable use for one of Hong Kong Keith's early tunics...

Attached File  Image012.jpg (87.56K)
Number of downloads: 36

Attached File  Image013.jpg (73.6K)
Number of downloads: 33

Rich
0

#14 User is offline   Moncello 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 220
  • Joined: 31-July 09
  • LocationUK

Posted 15 July 2011 - 08:10 AM

View PostRiccardo, on 14 July 2011 - 08:11 PM, said:

Not quite swords into ploughshares, but I hope an honourable use for one of Hong Kong Keith's early tunics...

Attachment Image012.jpg

Attachment Image013.jpg

Rich


Camerati,
The Might of the Coastal Divisions!.... :D
0

#15 User is offline   Frederico Aquini 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 235
  • Joined: 02-October 08
  • LocationOregon, US

Posted 04 May 2012 - 08:26 PM

View PostRiccardo, on 14 July 2011 - 08:11 PM, said:

Not quite swords into ploughshares, but I hope an honourable use for one of Hong Kong Keith's early tunics...

Attachment Image012.jpg

Attachment Image013.jpg

Rich


I have not been on the forum in quite a while...

Very nice job camerate! :) I have yet to try converting my tunic (an early Chen M40). If I should ever make up mind and convert the thing, I'll post photos.

Where did you find your black baize/badge cloth for the collar? I was thinking of scouring the thrift stores for a garment made out of a like material.

Frederico
0

#16 User is offline   Riccardo 

  • Sergente Maggiore
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 83
  • Joined: 05-August 09
  • LocationRegno Unito

Posted 07 June 2012 - 06:20 PM

Ciao Frederico

Sorry for the delay in replying - I'd completely lost this thread.

I bought the cloth from a company in the UK called H.E. Box Ltd. They were excellent and were happy to supply small quantities as well as large - I ordered various pieces of baize 1420mm (the set width) by 100mm (4") long. Their email address is: sales@he-box.co.uk

Hope this helps
Rich
0

#17 User is offline   Frederico Aquini 

  • Tenente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 235
  • Joined: 02-October 08
  • LocationOregon, US

Posted 28 August 2012 - 08:09 PM

View PostRiccardo, on 07 June 2012 - 06:20 PM, said:

Sorry for the delay in replying - I'd completely lost this thread.


Rich,

Please, no worries man! :) I haven't exactly been very prompt with replies lately myself.

Grazie for the info.! I'm going to have a go at the thrift stores first and if those don't pan out, I'll give that place a try.

Frederico
0

#18 User is offline   Giuseppe 

  • Sergente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 69
  • Joined: 19-August 09
  • LocationSydney,Australia

Posted 14 November 2012 - 12:32 AM

thatnks for this link, looking thru the repro tunics trying to identify the one worn by nonno {in my avatar} that pic was taken in 41 he too was 22 div however as can be seen the collar is not black like the example shown

was the black collar ment to designtae something else?
no ifs ands or butts ....just do it

Nonno P -Soldato/mitragliere - classe di 1923
arruolato - 17/4/1942 giunto alle armi - 7/1/1943
assegnato al 4 Rgt fanteria 29a div "Piemonte" trasferito al 30 Rgt fanteria pisa 26 Div 'Asseitta" fanteria da montagna 11/5/1943 servita nel Sicilia

Nonno I -Artigliere- classe di 1920
arruolato - 20/2/1939
assegnato al 1 Rgt artigieria div fant 22a div "Cacciatore delle Alpi trasferito al 151 Rgt artiglieria 151 Div "Perugia 10/3/42 servita nel fronte Balcano


if anyone has more info or pictures of any of these units id love to know about them
0

#19 User is offline   Jeff Leser 

  • Staff
  • Group: Moderators
  • Posts: 1,843
  • Joined: 20-May 04
  • LocationLeavenworth, KS

Posted 15 November 2012 - 02:08 AM

Giuseppe

The M33 giubba originally had collars based on branch colors or regimental colors (in the case of cavalry). In 1937 this was simplified to everyone wearing black collars on the M1937 giubba. Finally the M40 giubba eliminated the black collar and all giubba collars were in the same material as the tunic itself (g-v).

So a plain black collar (no color edging) in 1933 could indicate Bersaglieri, Alpini, pharmacist, quartermaster, and some others. The mostrine, should boards, fregio, and other items would allow you to identified the soldier as one of these.

Pista!

Jeff
btg. sciatori Alpini « Monte Cervino » (reenacted)
19° reggimento fanteria « Brescia » (reenacted)

#20 User is offline   Giuseppe 

  • Sergente
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 69
  • Joined: 19-August 09
  • LocationSydney,Australia

Posted 16 November 2012 - 04:57 AM

interesting

did all tunics have metal divisional badges on them or were they mainly cloth?

does anyone reproduce these as well?
no ifs ands or butts ....just do it

Nonno P -Soldato/mitragliere - classe di 1923
arruolato - 17/4/1942 giunto alle armi - 7/1/1943
assegnato al 4 Rgt fanteria 29a div "Piemonte" trasferito al 30 Rgt fanteria pisa 26 Div 'Asseitta" fanteria da montagna 11/5/1943 servita nel Sicilia

Nonno I -Artigliere- classe di 1920
arruolato - 20/2/1939
assegnato al 1 Rgt artigieria div fant 22a div "Cacciatore delle Alpi trasferito al 151 Rgt artiglieria 151 Div "Perugia 10/3/42 servita nel fronte Balcano


if anyone has more info or pictures of any of these units id love to know about them
0

Share this topic:


  • 2 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic


1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users